[DiscordArchive] Wait, are you saying they added returns to the game in expansions that weren't there before the expa
[DiscordArchive] Wait, are you saying they added returns to the game in expansions that weren't there before the expa
Original source
Wait, are you saying they added returns to the game in expansions that weren't there before the expansion was released or are you saying as you progressed through the content certain functions started working in a different way?
rektbyfaith
09-05-2022, 12:10 PM #1Archived author: Revision • Posted: 2022-09-05T12:10:42.136000+00:00
Original source
Wait, are you saying they added returns to the game in expansions that weren't there before the expansion was released or are you saying as you progressed through the content certain functions started working in a different way?
Original source
It suggests they added extra columns to their DB to support new functionality, but didn't even put default values into the old rows. We were always given the impression that while they'd go into the DB to change values for a single item (because twinks were always looking for those kinds of exploits), they were *very* reticent to run any scripts on the DB to find and modify a large number of entries. Like whatever solution they were using made it a lot harder than it is with SQL.
rektbyfaith
09-05-2022, 12:12 PM #2Archived author: Naomi (polarity) • Posted: 2022-09-05T12:12:44.704000+00:00
Original source
It suggests they added extra columns to their DB to support new functionality, but didn't even put default values into the old rows. We were always given the impression that while they'd go into the DB to change values for a single item (because twinks were always looking for those kinds of exploits), they were *very* reticent to run any scripts on the DB to find and modify a large number of entries. Like whatever solution they were using made it a lot harder than it is with SQL.
Original source
Adding new columns is something everyone does, even AC.
rektbyfaith
09-05-2022, 12:13 PM #3Archived author: Revision • Posted: 2022-09-05T12:13:26.459000+00:00
Original source
Adding new columns is something everyone does, even AC.
Original source
rest assured that the setting if a quest item drops for all players or one in a group was added before vanilla release. my example above proofs that. not sure how that's related to addon api.
rektbyfaith
09-05-2022, 12:13 PM #4Archived author: Honey • Posted: 2022-09-05T12:13:38.347000+00:00
Original source
rest assured that the setting if a quest item drops for all players or one in a group was added before vanilla release. my example above proofs that. not sure how that's related to addon api.
Original source
I don't know exactly what type of database they're using, and I understand they didn't want to go back to old content to add whatever flag is needed to all quest items which is why they did it beyond the previous expansion instead. It doesn't change the fact that they most likely reworked their loot system too. If AC were to entirely rewrite the loot system in the source code, the old one wouldn't still be there for pre-wotlk content but it would do the entire system.
rektbyfaith
09-05-2022, 12:15 PM #5Archived author: Revision • Posted: 2022-09-05T12:15:28.297000+00:00
Original source
I don't know exactly what type of database they're using, and I understand they didn't want to go back to old content to add whatever flag is needed to all quest items which is why they did it beyond the previous expansion instead. It doesn't change the fact that they most likely reworked their loot system too. If AC were to entirely rewrite the loot system in the source code, the old one wouldn't still be there for pre-wotlk content but it would do the entire system.
Original source
What could happen though of course is someone decided to make all quest items drop for all members, maybe they decided to only do the wotlk content and skip anything before it. That's different.
rektbyfaith
09-05-2022, 12:16 PM #6Archived author: Revision • Posted: 2022-09-05T12:16:15.667000+00:00
Original source
What could happen though of course is someone decided to make all quest items drop for all members, maybe they decided to only do the wotlk content and skip anything before it. That's different.
Original source
Items are not the only thing that changed by the way. A very good example is the first quests on the horde side in warsong hold in borean tundra. Destroying cocoons to make orcs appear doesn't trigger for every member of a group but only gives +1 to the player who destroyed the cocoon. That's why I'm reworking most of those things ,but obviously it's not blizzlike so that's not going in the AC repo.
rektbyfaith
09-05-2022, 12:18 PM #7Archived author: Revision • Posted: 2022-09-05T12:18:46.451000+00:00
Original source
Items are not the only thing that changed by the way. A very good example is the first quests on the horde side in warsong hold in borean tundra. Destroying cocoons to make orcs appear doesn't trigger for every member of a group but only gives +1 to the player who destroyed the cocoon. That's why I'm reworking most of those things ,but obviously it's not blizzlike so that's not going in the AC repo.
Original source
*individual* quest items yes. In retail, ones which required a greater amount to be collected and turned in per character, *only* became lootable by every party member *much* later, suggesting something was making a fix that would have greatly improved open-world group questing (because how many times were the rest of parties waiting for the last member to collect their last required item?), more complex than searching the DB and changing the loot type.
rektbyfaith
09-05-2022, 12:30 PM #8Archived author: Naomi (polarity) • Posted: 2022-09-05T12:30:46.259000+00:00
Original source
*individual* quest items yes. In retail, ones which required a greater amount to be collected and turned in per character, *only* became lootable by every party member *much* later, suggesting something was making a fix that would have greatly improved open-world group questing (because how many times were the rest of parties waiting for the last member to collect their last required item?), more complex than searching the DB and changing the loot type.
Original source
I think they just started adding the flag to more quest items and not just the "loot his stupid head for me".
rektbyfaith
09-05-2022, 12:33 PM #9Archived author: Revision • Posted: 2022-09-05T12:33:41.270000+00:00
Original source
I think they just started adding the flag to more quest items and not just the "loot his stupid head for me".
Original source
It's game development, not an open source project. If there's any uncertainty about how long a fix is going to take, someone in charge *will* put it off until everything *needed* for the next expansion is done. And they'll put off updating old content to new standards even longer, because that's someone else's old work, and they want the whole team working on the expansion they're lead designer for.
I wanted to be a game dev since I was 8, but once I got round to actually studying it at Uni, 28 years later (as opposed to general CS/computer media), and *really* started looking properly into studio culture and practices (crunch, crunch, crunch), I decided I never want to be a part of something that's always chasing the next big thing they can have the marketing department hype up, over ever fixing existing issues, no matter how simple that may be.
EVE:Online was, briefly, a breath of fresh air among all the other studios I was following, with their 'Team Little Things', an actual group of developers within a studio, whose entire purpose was to iterate on what *already* existed, and who would not be assigned by team leads to other projects.
rektbyfaith
09-05-2022, 12:46 PM #10Archived author: Naomi (polarity) • Posted: 2022-09-05T12:46:11.900000+00:00
Original source
It's game development, not an open source project. If there's any uncertainty about how long a fix is going to take, someone in charge *will* put it off until everything *needed* for the next expansion is done. And they'll put off updating old content to new standards even longer, because that's someone else's old work, and they want the whole team working on the expansion they're lead designer for.
I wanted to be a game dev since I was 8, but once I got round to actually studying it at Uni, 28 years later (as opposed to general CS/computer media), and *really* started looking properly into studio culture and practices (crunch, crunch, crunch), I decided I never want to be a part of something that's always chasing the next big thing they can have the marketing department hype up, over ever fixing existing issues, no matter how simple that may be.
EVE:Online was, briefly, a breath of fresh air among all the other studios I was following, with their 'Team Little Things', an actual group of developers within a studio, whose entire purpose was to iterate on what *already* existed, and who would not be assigned by team leads to other projects.
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